Fidentireplicascid paradox 4

File cid par/fidentireplicas 12:46 am Tuesday, February 27 2001

How does the Cid paradox effect experiments with fidentireplicas

Consider these experiments

The first one is where we remove part of a brain but continue to supply the stimulation that that part of the brain would have provided. This part of the brain is a part that is the source of pain for instance it can be anything sight smell etc but in this case we say it is the source of pain or we say it is the part of the brain that if missing there will be no pain of a certain type. There should be no pain of this certain type in the awarepath but the rest of the brain acts like there is this pain so the awarepath has no pain but the body is saying there is this pain the awarepath sees it body responding in a way that the awarepath is not having the pain because the part of the brain that actually produces it is missing but it is stimulated as if this brain was there. The problem for the awarepath to be aware of the difference it would have to function differently. ( does it actually have to function differently for the awarepath to know there is no pain but it is still responding like there is ) lets say that the person want to respond that there is a difference in what he is saying and what he actually is feeling for this to happen there has to be a difference in the functioning in the body to produce the sentence I don’t feel this pain And I don’t know why I said this. Hearing this causes even more divergence in the functioning of the brain from the original but the brain is supposed to continue the same where does this change come from. Because of Qm. the functioning can diverge the input would have to behave as if it is getting this different input from the brain.

We can also look at this as if the consciousness will not know that there was not this pain because it is told by the missing functioning that there is actually this pain. So if there actually is this same awarepath being produced where is the pain being produced? There are several ways of generating these signals. One is through communication between the part of the brain that is removed so that the brain is stimulate just as if the removed part was there. Another way is by a device that does the same calculations to create the correct stimulation that this removed part of the brain does. Will this artificial system produce the identical consciousness? Another is by a predetermined or pre known set of sequences that give the correct response. It could be as rudimentary as possible or as complex as needed. What happens when the predetermined set of stimuli is responding to the qm effected or varied brain rather than the modified version. We would get a difference in functioning of the rest of the brain if this difference was large enough the brain might converge back to its original functioning.

What if we have the situation where the stimulation is not exactly correct but close so that the functioning in the rest of the brain is still the same because it smooth's over the difference with its own processing?

It could be that no part of the brain by itself produces consciousness.

What is the result of this experiment? Will the fidentireplica feel --experience a cid paradox. Will it respond to this cid paradox? Will it remember this paradox? Over time? If it did without a change in the structure or functioning, it means that there can be more than one consciousness that is produced by one functioning we will have no way to tell which is which from observing the function. Or it means that there is a mind independent of the brain and not connected to it. But we know that changing functioning and structure change consciousness. If there is a change in structure and functioning that corresponds to this different consciousness what caused it? it was not the brain or the missing brain part because it still functioned like it was there.

It would seem that what ever way there would be the consciousness produced or it is not aware that there is not this consciousness produced. But if you are not aware of not being aware how if you say you feel this heart and you actually don’t. Why would you not be aware of the difference?

We can continue this experiment in may different ways one is gradually increasing the amount of brain that is removed until there is none left but the nerves connected to the body the body will still behave like it would have there will be no where for the cid paradox to come from the person can not behave any different from how he is told to behave..

This might be a proof that knowledge is consciousness because the functioning case where there is no processing but there is the knowledge and how to apply it to the neurons In this case we have the same result as in the other two cases but there is no processing of the input and output information there is preknowledge and how to get this knowledge to effect the remaining neurons. The information on how to duplicate this functioning is knowledge but not in a processing form. However this information has to be generated into the stimulus of the system.

This case would mean that the information is

This information could still be some where else and the information could still be transmitted over a distance. But at the spot that the signal is transmitted the information has to be converted to signals sent to the neurons

Now if it (consciousness) is not the functioning of the neurons what is it? Is it knowledge. But what are the limiting factors of knowledge? Either it is the behavior of several things

There is no connection to the reality of where the consciousness is produced and where it seems to be produced.

How does this effect time consciousness is produced in a certain time

What happens if we set up an experiment in time where the information exists in the past is destroyed and only the base necessity of information is used and no processing is occurring in the present where is the consciousness existing in what time? Again is there just enough how to and physical change in the present to make the awarepath exist?

We can think in these possible ways. First, the consciousness is produced in these different ways on the spot. There is no consciousness produced. Or the consciousness is spread over space and time in the functioning of the neurons or the knowledge that these neurons represent or generate. What if it is both it can be spread over space and time and generated on the spot.

If consciousness is spread over time with both functioning of neurons and knowledge when is it happening? In the past in the present spread through time where time is just a dimension and knowledge / consciousness ties together through space and time. Or even other dimensions. Could there be a knowledge dimension that has strange knowledge consciousness properties this seems like mental dualism with a twist there is not mind substance there is a mind dimension? Or dimensions? Where these dimensions tie together knowledge and matter? For every changing universe there is knowledge about that universe. The knowledge about the combinations of matter far out weigh or out group the original matter. There is always so many different ways of looking at matter where it is what it is how it affect other matter knowledge. About matter is represented by matter.

How does matter come together to form a conscious whole of any type?

What are the possibilities for the cid paradox in the situation of removing parts of the brain? Can we actually generate the brain producing consciousness where there is a cid paradox. What would we need in this situation?

Can a cid paradox be created where there is a divergence in functioning. Some how the awarepath (mind) would have to short circuit the functioning of the brain. This would mean that there is something else effecting the brain other than the normal physical environment. How would this awareness be created of a cid paradox? In the physipath the “I feel pain but I do not sense this the body would have to be behaving differently than the awarepath thinks it should. Of course, the sensepath can be any thing not at all connected with the real environment of the physipath. So a sensepath could be created where

What if the pain in this first experiment is actually spread over the entire brain so that if we remove the entire pain we have to remove so much of the brain that there is no longer consciousness? Does this mean that there can not be the cid paradox because there can not be a complete removal of any aspect of a consciousness with out removing all the aspects of consciousness.

Another experiment we can take a person and tell him what we are going to do and ask him what will what he feels. First we remove parts of his brain but keep the rest of the brain functioning like it would have with out the removal of these parts. We can gradually remove more and more. Until all is gone except the neurons that go to the muscles and the senses if every thing is reproduced exactly he will respond exactly as if no brain had been removed If he does not then there has to be something that occurs to the neurons that are left that does not happen to the original neurons we do not have less because we say that we stimulate everything exactly the only difference will be qm fluxuations so the out put could be different. Of course if it is different we have the reason for the difference being the qm effect. The Qm effect being that there is only a probability that some thing different will happen with each atom it may be a very low probability but it is still a probability. And if we add the probability together of all the atoms some will diverge. But the divergence of some will be over come by the smoothing out of divergence of others but as a general rule the divergence will add up over time.

Of course divergence of the functioning is not caused by the mind and if the divergence is returned to the identical way of functioning the consciousness will return to being identical a certain way

Will this person ever really feel a difference. He will not report it if the original arrangement what happens if we reinstall the original l brain If the original brain

We can look at this as there being three the original a complete cidentireplica and the various fidentireplicas and the changing fidentireplica the fidentireplica that changes into the original and back and forth how would this be does by diverging the signals

There can be a different consciousness. If we take an extra functioning brain or consciousness system that monitors the way the brain in functioning and can tell the difference between the two In the same way that if we looked into the brain of the fidentireplica and noticed that there was no brain there and then looked into the original and knew that there was a difference. What seem to be simple concepts of consciousness like pain or seeing a color is actually a complex changing neurosystem. Not a simple few neurons firing. We know the extent of the pain if we compare the difference in the brain functioning when there is this pain and when there is not this pain. The pain is the difference in the two functionings

Any mental characteristic we can determine this way. If we take the brains with this emotion and then the functioning with out this emotion. The whole point is that there are all sorts of versions of each mental aspect and in fact all sorts of

With this definition we can again look at the fidentireplica and the cid paradox. The pain is defined as the difference of the brain of the original with out the pain with the original or cidentireplica with the pain if we remove that difference we remove that pain but if we remove all of the parts of the brain that functionings differently but replace it will functioning replacements we will still get the same behavior because the rest of the brain will still be functioning the same. It won’t if there are neurons that sense a difference but this would be adding to the neurosystem that the original does not have .In this case we are parducing extra meaning and functioing that responds to that meaning

Can we set up any monitoring of the brains functionig that actually would experience the brain not experinceing this pain.

The large neurosystem might create a consciousness that is aware that there is a difference between how the system behaves or does no behave and what it feels when this behavior is creates and not created again there can be the stimulas that creates in the super system the feeling that there actually is the feelong that there is pain even when there is not a bain to propduce it